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+--- Thread: Starship Feedback (/showthread.php?tid=8)
Starship Feedback - CaffeinePowered - 03-24-2008
Now that the beta is finally out I need all the feedback I can get, so please give me some real critical analysis of what is good and what is bad on the map, try to be detailed and honest. Part of making something like this is, if you think it sucks, be honest and back it up with why.
Proposed Changes for Beta 2:
- Improve Cartoony Nature of Textures - sorta done
- Reduce ammo box size in final cap room - finished 5/17
- Add additional entry point to final cap room (team specific possibly) - finished 5/17
- Replace stairways from final cap to bridge with a winding spiral - finished 5/12
- Add underground tunnel to get from bridge to engineroom - finished 4/19
- Improved lighting -finished 5/18
- Additional polish (ie, inaccessible areas like the manager's offices) - finished 5/29
- Add starfield texture and windows. - finished 5/29
- Center Room Clutter - finished - 4/13
- Add Shelving units to center for warehouse feel - finished - 4/13
More Change Log:
Added Basement Capture Point - Gives respawn bonus - finished - 6/10
Added Progressive Spawns - finished - 6/10
Re: Starship Feedback - Surf314 - 03-24-2008
I still say what I like about it is also what is causing some trouble. Specifically the non-linearity. It's awesome how all three middle points are up for grabs at all times but it spreads out the team very thin and you need some way to compensate that for the final cap. I'm not sure how. If you just increased the cap time for the final point it could help, but that might make it too hard for the capping team because its right outside the spawn. I think the big issue is having to guard 4 entrances and cap points, most maps have 2 entrances 3 max for the final point. You just don't have enough manpower to do that effectively so it adds a lot of luck. I wouldn't take out the vent though, I like that. I don't know caff it's a tough call to keep what makes it awesome and to fix the final cap so it isn't too hard to guard without turtleing.
I do love the map however.
Re: Starship Feedback - Eschatos - 03-24-2008
I haven't played it yet, so I'll tell you tomorrow.
Re: Starship Feedback - CaffeinePowered - 03-24-2008
Surf I was actually considering making the final cap easier, the thing is the map is meant for 8v8 or greater in terms of number of people. When that happens a team is going to have 3 or more engineers. SGs can go up at the last cap point very very fast, so when you do get pushed back, defenses are up almost immediately.
Ideally what Id like to see is something to force the team to start pushing out or be squashed because you can't turtle very well. Doing so would also force the other team to defend its points lest it find itself attacking a locked point with their pants down. Thus making game play much much more frantic and hopefully more fun as well.
I need more extensive testing and feed back however in terms of how the map plays overall before I go and do that, just a handful of runs on a full server is no long term indication of how the map will play as people figure out more and better strategies.
Re: Starship Feedback - Surf314 - 03-24-2008
What you really need is a bunch of games where you know the teams are balanced, so you know for a fact the things that are unbalanced in the map. Also it'd be good to get class specific feedback to make sure no class is at a disadvantage. Because I always hate that in a map.
So far I think its pretty balanced as far as classes. The stairs are a bitch for soldiers especially going down, and for demomen especially going up. Of course that kinda balances out but makes heavies have an advantage. Of course they are less effective at a distance. I'm not sure where this is going. I don't think there's anything major that needs fixing.
Re: Starship Feedback - Mission Difficult - 03-24-2008
I know it's not a gameplay thing, but I think it would be really cool if you could see stars whizzing by in the windows in the spawn points. Might make the map laggy? Just think it would look sweet. I really like the freedom teams have with control points, being able to try and capture all three or just get two and rush the final point. Certainly adds a new dynamic to capturing points. I feel like the center point might be a little cluttered with objects, maybe that's just me...
Re: Starship Feedback - CaffeinePowered - 03-24-2008
Forgot to mention that...I do have a moving starfield texture, I just have not implemented it.
Also it would not make the map very laggy if I properly put in area portals. For example in convoy, its the moving props (the rocks), that make the map really laggy, not the moving textures on the bottom of the map.
Re: Starship Feedback - Mission Difficult - 03-24-2008
Sweet!Â
Re: Starship Feedback - Kor - 03-24-2008
I think the ammo box size at the last point is fine, it keeps with the no-huddle defense. I'll agree with the additional paths between the Engine Room/Bridge though, its a long haul currently.
Re: Starship Feedback - Chooly - 03-24-2008
The control room capture room could benefit from widening the one entrance (Far right cap, on reds side if I'm not mistaken)
Re: Starship Feedback - Budr - 03-25-2008
Not having played on a full server, I'm in the same boat as Surf, in that I found the last point too easy to cap. If it's too hard with more players though, I don't have an answer, sorry.
On a purely aesthetic level, I don't like that the cargo hold is so bright. My personal penchant for all things dark and brooding aside, it doesn't seem to fit with the lighting in the rest of the level.
I like the sound of the spiral starcase.
Re: Starship Feedback - WTF Joel - 03-25-2008
I think it still feels a bit too open..
Re: Starship Feedback - ScottyGrayskull - 03-26-2008
Didn't play it last night, although running through solo I noticed something with the cap points:
If I got it correctly a team has to capture two points to unlock the third. I like that, as needing all three would create too many stalemates since it's easy to cap one point while the opponent is capping their third.
Something I noticed though is if one team caps two points (unlocking blue's final point), and blue retakes one of those two leaving the third still uncapped, shouldn't their final point lock back up? Doubt it happens very often, and I kind of stumbled on it by accident, but... yeah. :p
Other than that I suppose some cosmetic things. A lot of the hallways feel pretty empty. I know it's a starship, but some decorations couldn't hurt.
Re: Starship Feedback - HuckBerryGee - 04-01-2008
direction signs for the disoriented à la science? Too many times have I tried to capture the wrong point(ok that was 3 times only).
Re: Starship Feedback - Luca Shoal - 04-01-2008
The displays for which point needs to be capped/re-capped should be more obvious.
To actually make that make sense... you've got things set up coming from the Red side. The HUD showing which points belong to what side are reversed for the blue team. Hopefully that makes sense enough.
Re: Starship Feedback - ScottyGrayskull - 04-02-2008
What Luca said. It's easy to mess up and go to the wrong side if you're blue. Otherwise it was a lot of fun. Always good when you can sneak in and steal a point.
The last point surprisingly took awhile to cap. With the amount of ways to enter the room I would've thought it would be a steamroll, although constantly having to worry about the middle points seemed to help prevent that.
Re: Starship Feedback - Vandamguy - 04-02-2008
now that ive actually played it a few times.
there are some times when im running around and i will still get lost in the hallways, the problem being that the map is too symmetrical. reds hallways look the same as blues hallways so you dont know which way is what.
Re: Starship Feedback - cannedpeahes - 04-07-2008
It's a little broad. The points which most needed defended - the last cap on either side, and the center room - are so roomy they're almost indefensible. That could be fixed by cramping them up a bit with extra geometry and stuff.
Re: Starship Feedback - Negate - 04-08-2008
At the bottom of the ramp to the upper point its dark enough that seeing what team someone is while they stand there is somewhat difficult not a huge problem. Also If you are trying to cap one of the side points to seal off your last point and the other team has all of them you have no real way to stop them from capping your last point unless someone is also capping another point. Basically if the other team holds all the middle points you as a team have to defend your last point and launch at least 2 assaults on the middle to prevent the other team from capping. Attackers have the advantage generally because they have only one goal unless the defense rallies and takes back 2 points before you cap their last point the defense loses or turtles which eventually loses.
Re: Starship Feedback - Vandamguy - 04-09-2008
this map is killin the server.