Versus mode

[KarthXLR]

Expert versus mode = IMPOSSIBLE



IMPOSSSSSSSSIBLE!!!!!

[cbre88x]

I haven't played with Dave yet, but I've gotten pretty badass at the game. I'd love to do a full expert run.

[Benito Mussolini]

I haven't played with Dave yet, but I've gotten pretty badass at the game. I'd love to do a full expert run.

[Dave]

no hunting rifles in my group sunny jim.

[Surf314]

no hunting rifles in my group sunny jim.

Screw you hunting rifles are superior if you can aim half decent.  One shot kills to all zombies plus penetration power that would impress even Budr.  Seriously you get them to run at you in a line and a couple shots will take out the whole bunch.  And my favorite bit about it is using it helps you learn to be really conservative with your shooting so not only do you not worry about running out of ammo but you hit your teammates a lot less as well.

The only shitty thing is if your teammate runs in front of you when you shoot you are almost certain to kill them.

[Dave]

[quote author=Dave link=topic=1843.msg51520#msg51520 date=1227701167]
no hunting rifles in my group sunny jim.

Screw you hunting rifles are superior if you can aim half decent.  One shot kills to all zombies plus penetration power that would impress even Budr.  Seriously you get them to run at you in a line and a couple shots will take out the whole bunch.  And my favorite bit about it is using it helps you learn to be really conservative with your shooting so not only do you not worry about running out of ammo but you hit your teammates a lot less as well.

The only shitty thing is if your teammate runs in front of you when you shoot you are almost certain to kill them.
[/quote]

then a tank comes along, and your doing dick all damage.

[Surf314]

[quote author=Surf314 link=topic=1843.msg51528#msg51528 date=1227709942]
[quote author=Dave link=topic=1843.msg51520#msg51520 date=1227701167]
no hunting rifles in my group sunny jim.

Screw you hunting rifles are superior if you can aim half decent.  One shot kills to all zombies plus penetration power that would impress even Budr.  Seriously you get them to run at you in a line and a couple shots will take out the whole bunch.  And my favorite bit about it is using it helps you learn to be really conservative with your shooting so not only do you not worry about running out of ammo but you hit your teammates a lot less as well.

The only shitty thing is if your teammate runs in front of you when you shoot you are almost certain to kill them.
[/quote]

then a tank comes along, and your doing dick all damage.
[/quote]

Best strategy for tank is still light on fire -> run away.  Also are you sure?  Hunter rifle does most damage per bullet to all other zombie types.

[x]

Also are you sure?  Hunter rifle does most damage per bullet to all other zombie types.

I think Dave is getting confused.

Personally, I just find the rifle hugely unsatisfying to use. I've always loved how weapons in Valve games have this real tactile weight to them (see the L4D auto-shotty), which just seems to be missing from the rifle.

[K2]

[quote author=Surf314 link=topic=1843.msg51539#msg51539 date=1227716368]
Also are you sure?  Hunter rifle does most damage per bullet to all other zombie types.

I think Dave is getting confused.

Personally, I just find the rifle hugely unsatisfying to use. I've always loved how weapons in Valve games have this real tactile weight to them (see the L4D auto-shotty), which just seems to be missing from the rifle.
[/quote]

I think it's pretty damn satisfying to headshot two zombies with one bullet.

[Surf314]

You know what I think it is?  When you are standing still your aim is pinpoint accuracy, you don't even have to crouch.  But when you are running your aim goes to shit.  You are usually running from the tank.  I think it would be very useful if the tank was after other people and you were nailing him in the head and so on but as soon as he turns to you you are a bit fucked.

I still think fire -> run away is the best tactic as its generally the safest.

[K2]

You know what I think it is?  When you are standing still your aim is pinpoint accuracy, you don't even have to crouch.  But when you are running your aim goes to shit.  You are usually running from the tank.  I think it would be very useful if the tank was after other people and you were nailing him in the head and so on but as soon as he turns to you you are a bit fucked.

I still think fire -> run away is the best tactic as its generally the safest.

Yeah, you kind of look like an asshole when you're standing thirty feet away from the tank pounding on your friends, but it's the best way to take him out with the rifle. Also it's almost impossible to kill a smoker with the rifle if he gets you with the tongue before you hit him. I've had a couple instances where I get four shots right on him from less than fifteen feet away and miss every single one just because he's slowly pullling me towards him.

[Wedge]

Yeah afaik, the Hunting Rifle is actually the BEST weapon to take down a Tank if used properly.  I believe it does headshot damage, so if you unload a clip into the Tank's head, it's going down fast.  No idea if that's really the case, but I've never seen him go down faster then when he got laid into with a Hunting Rifle.

[Dave]

Yeah afaik, the Hunting Rifle is actually the BEST weapon to take down a Tank if used properly.  I believe it does headshot damage, so if you unload a clip into the Tank's head, it's going down fast.  No idea if that's really the case, but I've never seen him go down faster then when he got laid into with a Hunting Rifle.

i prefer to molotov him then keep aggro with the combat, sinceim not a pussy.
a tank aint gonna let you scope on expert and it takes about 30 combat shotgun rounds close range to the face to kill a tank, no mater how good you are with the rifle you cant no scope its face while running away enough times to make a difference, taking down a tank means kiting and shooting whatever the fuck you have all the time, no pissing about with trying to shoot it in the face, its busy eating your mate.

[Surf314]

[quote author=Wedge link=topic=1843.msg51575#msg51575 date=1227728916]
Yeah afaik, the Hunting Rifle is actually the BEST weapon to take down a Tank if used properly.  I believe it does headshot damage, so if you unload a clip into the Tank's head, it's going down fast.  No idea if that's really the case, but I've never seen him go down faster then when he got laid into with a Hunting Rifle.

i prefer to molotov him then keep aggro with the combat, sinceim not a pussy.
a tank aint gonna let you scope on expert and it takes about 30 combat shotgun rounds close range to the face to kill a tank, no mater how good you are with the rifle you cant no scope its face while running away enough times to make a difference, taking down a tank means kiting and shooting whatever the fuck you have all the time, no pissing about with trying to shoot it in the face, its busy eating your mate.
[/quote]

I see two things already wrong with this.  You assume you need to scope to use the hunting rifle.  It is very accurate unscoped already.  Scoping is just useful for long range zombie clearing and scouting.  Also you weren't on IRC for this but in the L4D steamforums its been discussed that the fire damage and bullet damage to the tank are not additive.  This is because it appears the way that L4D handles fire damage for the tank is to start a timer counting down his life and it is not subtracting the damage directly to the tanks health.  This basically means you beat the tank by either shooting it to death or setting it on fire and running away.  Doing both is useless.

Also there is a theory that like the fire thing there is another counter for melees where if you melee the tank 8 times it will kill it as well.  But if this is the case then it is the same thing it does not add to bullet damage.

[Dave]

[quote author=Dave link=topic=1843.msg51578#msg51578 date=1227729178]
[quote author=Wedge link=topic=1843.msg51575#msg51575 date=1227728916]
Yeah afaik, the Hunting Rifle is actually the BEST weapon to take down a Tank if used properly.  I believe it does headshot damage, so if you unload a clip into the Tank's head, it's going down fast.  No idea if that's really the case, but I've never seen him go down faster then when he got laid into with a Hunting Rifle.

i prefer to molotov him then keep aggro with the combat, sinceim not a pussy.
a tank aint gonna let you scope on expert and it takes about 30 combat shotgun rounds close range to the face to kill a tank, no mater how good you are with the rifle you cant no scope its face while running away enough times to make a difference, taking down a tank means kiting and shooting whatever the fuck you have all the time, no pissing about with trying to shoot it in the face, its busy eating your mate.
[/quote]

I see two things already wrong with this.  You assume you need to scope to use the hunting rifle.  It is very accurate unscoped already.  Scoping is just useful for long range zombie clearing and scouting.  Also you weren't on IRC for this but in the L4D steamforums its been discussed that the fire damage and bullet damage to the tank are not additive.  This is because it appears the way that L4D handles fire damage for the tank is to start a timer counting down his life and it is not subtracting the damage directly to the tanks health.  This basically means you beat the tank by either shooting it to death or setting it on fire and running away.  Doing both is useless.

Also there is a theory that like the fire thing there is another counter for melees where if you melee the tank 8 times it will kill it as well.  But if this is the case then it is the same thing it does not add to bullet damage.
[/quote]

the main reason i keep shooting him, i like to think i can run and dodge a tank pretty well, so i take it upon myself to keep him busy.

also, valve arent retarded, i doubt they wouldnt add bullet damage to fire damage, have you ever shot a zombie while its on fire? it goes down.

[Surf314]

A lot of people seemed to think it was the case.  Also other exploits and stuff I've found is people binding kill to a key and using it as a tactic when they are a boomer.  Like dropping in the middle of people and purposefully exploding on them.  Another is that many people on expert will kill themselves before the safe room if they have less than 50 health so they won't have to use up a medpack.

Lemme see if anything else is posted on that tank issue.

[Surf314]

Dave may be good, but he is no Chicago Ted!

[Surf314]

Dave I asked someone on the steam forums and he tested the tank fire damage thing, here is the response:

Surf, I read the posts you are talking about. I tried testing it myself and...well I'm not sure.

- In one test I threw a molotov at a tank and he died in 30 seconds.
- In another test I constantly threw molotovs at a tank to see if they stacked, and he still died in 30 seconds.
- Then I threw a molotov and shot him with an M16 and he died in 30 seconds.
- Finally, I put two gas cans at his feet, threw a molotov at him, shot at the gas cans to make sure they ignighted, and shot him with the autoshotty at point blank and...he died in 22 seconds. This totally through me off.

I don't know what to think. There was probably some error on my part, but...I don't know. I'm confused.

LOL, the only thing I can think of is they don't stack but the last time he was able to do damage faster than the fire damage could kill him.

[ScottyGrayskull]

Dave I asked someone on the steam forums and he tested the tank fire damage thing, here is the response:

Surf, I read the posts you are talking about. I tried testing it myself and...well I'm not sure.

- In one test I threw a molotov at a tank and he died in 30 seconds.
- In another test I constantly threw molotovs at a tank to see if they stacked, and he still died in 30 seconds.
- Then I threw a molotov and shot him with an M16 and he died in 30 seconds.
- Finally, I put two gas cans at his feet, threw a molotov at him, shot at the gas cans to make sure they ignighted, and shot him with the autoshotty at point blank and...he died in 22 seconds. This totally through me off.

I don't know what to think. There was probably some error on my part, but...I don't know. I'm confused.

Maybe the gas cans or propane tanks count on top of fire?

LOL, the only thing I can think of is they don't stack but the last time he was able to do damage faster than the fire damage could kill him.

[Versus]

Another is that many people on expert will kill themselves before the safe room if they have less than 50 health so they won't have to use up a medpack.

I wish more people would do this. :-\